Cross posted to the MRC's NewsBusters blog
On his eponymous Sunday morning show, MSNBC host Ali Velshi gave a forum to frequent guest Elie Mystal of The Nation to encourage leftists to resist the Donald Trump administration as if they were living in the Jim Crow era or under dictators Adolf Hitler or Josef Stalin. Velshi also suggested that it is acceptable to get arrested trying to shield illegals from being arrested by ICE.
As he introduced the segment, Velshi referred to laws being broken by civil rights activists in the 1960s and the good that came of it, and then brought up New York City comptroller Brad Landers recently getting arrested for interfering with ICE agents at immigration court:
The civil rights hero John Lewis did not see immediate change when he marched in Selma in 1965, but he and those who marched with him forced the nation to reckon with the violence that stood in the way of democracy. Today these small acts of resistance are unfolding across America, carried out by ordinary people far from the halls of power. In Manhattan the city comptroller, Brad Lander, and other activists have been showing up to immigration court to observe ICE proceedings. In June Lander was arrested after linking arms with a man who agents were trying to detain. Now, he's urging migrants to skip court hearings altogether, calling them "abduction traps."
He soon brought up a piece published by Mystal that encourages anti-Trump activists to resist:
But going to court to bear witness and stand in solidarity with undocumented immigrants is something open to all of us. It's something that increasing number of Americans are, in fact, doing. For some Americans, the resistance has gone far beyond quiet protest. Eli Mystal observes that, at all points in history, there are people who are willing to break the law when the law is evil.
As Mystal appeared as a guest, he mused about what he would like to tell his grandchildren who might ask him how he reacted to President Trump, and then recommended that liberal activists behave like opponents of Hitler and Stalin:
So what we are doing right now -- what anybody who is listening to me is doing right now is what you would have done at all of those great and evil points in history. What you're doing right now is what you would have done during Jim Crow. What you're doing right now is what you would have done during Pinochet or Hitler or Stalin or any of the other bad guys in history. What you're doing right now is what you would have done then.
Velshi soon suggested that some activists may want to break the law like Landers did against ICE:
There are people -- good people of conscience in America who are looking for a road map as to what that looks like. It doesn't mean getting arrested, but, like those people in Cape May, they're going out there, and they're consistent. For some people it might mean getting arrested or it might be showing up to protect people at protests so the police don't arrest them. There are -- or it could be like Brad Landers. There are lots of ways to do this.
Mystal went on to recall that when he encounters an Uber driver who listens to right-wing media that he demands that they turn it off: "Right now, if I'm in an Uber and they're putting on, you know, state propaganda TV, I will be like, 'Turn that mess of, please, sir, and here are 10 reasons why.' Like, that -- it's not something I like doing, but it's something that I have to do in this moment, right?"
Transcript follows:
MSNBC's Velshi
August 31, 2025
11:02 a.m. Eastern
ALI VELSHI: The civil rights hero John Lewis did not see immediate change when he marched in Selma in 1965, but he and those who marched with him forced the nation to reckon with the violence that stood in the way of democracy. Today these small acts of resistance are unfolding across America, carried out by ordinary people far from the halls of power. In Manhattan the city comptroller, Brad Lander, and other activists have been showing up to immigration court to observe ICE proceedings. In June Lander was arrested after linking arms with a man who agents were trying to detain. Now, he's urging migrants to skip court hearings altogether, calling them "abduction traps."
But here's the thing. This isn't Brad Lander's job. He's the New York City comptroller. He was there as a citizen, albeit a citizen with some authority. But going to court to bear witness and stand in solidarity with undocumented immigrants is something open to all of us. It's something that increasing number of Americans are, in fact, doing. For some Americans, the resistance has gone far beyond quiet protest. Eli Mystal observes that, at all points in history, there are people who are willing to break the law when the law is evil.
(...)
ELIE MYSTAL, THE NATION: At some point, I'm going to have grandchildren, and they are going to ask me, "Granddad, Grandpap,what did you do when the bad man come?" And what am I going to say to those kids, right? What am I going to say to my future grandkids about what I did in this moment? The answer can't be nothing. The answer can't be, "Well, I voted against the bad guy, and I got a real good tax break." That can't be all I say when they ask me what I did, right? So that's like one thing that I use to recenter and refocus and reenergize myself.
The other thing that I try to remember is that I do not come from a defeated people. If people who looked like me back in the day gave up, gave in to despair, I'd still be out in the fields somewhere, right? But people who had absolutely no chance of victory continued to push the rock and continued to fight. So what we are doing right now -- what anybody who is listening to me is doing right now is what you would have done at all of those great and evil points in history. What you're doing right now is what you would have done during Jim Crow. What you're doing right now is what you would have done during Pinochet or Hitler or Stalin or any of the other bad guys in history. What you're doing right now is what you would have done then.
(...)
VELSHI: There are people -- good people of conscience in America who are looking for a road map as to what that looks like. It doesn't mean getting arrested, but, like those people in Cape May, they're going out there, and they're consistent. For some people it might mean getting arrested or it might be showing up to protect people at protests so the police don't arrest them. There are -- or it could be like Brad Landers. There are lots of ways to do this.
(...)
MYSTAL: You make a good point about the -- getting out of your comfort zone. Sometimes this requires being impolite. I'm not necessarily a person that wants to like have a shouting match on the subway or have a -- get into an argument with an Uber driver, but I will. But I will. Right now, if I'm in an Uber and they're putting on, you know, state propaganda TV, I will be like, "Turn that mess of, please, sir, and here are 10 reasons why." Like, that -- it's not something I like doing, but it's something that I have to do in this moment, right?
So, yeah, you do have to get a little bit outside of the things that are comfortable because that's the other thing that fascists and authoritarians use -- your own desire for comfort, your own desire for normalcy. You, in your mind, make these abnormal things normal because you just want to get about your day.
VELSHI: Yup.
MYSTAL: And that also is what you have to fight against. They want you to be comfortable. Be uncomfortable -- be uncomfortable all the time. They want you to be -- to find ways of coping -- find ways of making it all seem okay. It's not okay, and we just have to live in this moment where it's not okay.
VELSHI: Elie, I thank you for the important - for the important column and for you being here this morning.
